TechConnectify , Englisch
@TechConnectify@mas.to avatar

My charge from last night on a 30A charger (7.2 kW at 240V).

This is why I'm always harping on the "stop installing giant charger circuits" thing! Even this is a luxury - I only charge about weekly or if I make a long trip.

For USians, a 10 gauge run of wiring will deliver 5 kW sustained. You'll only ever think that's slow if you drive a TON and/or have a really big vehicle.

Especially if you're thinking of DIYing an install, 10 gauge is so much easier to deal with.

kyriii ,
@kyriii@troet.cafe avatar

@TechConnectify another thing to consider (but I haven’t done a fact check) is the efficiency of chargers (the thing in the car) at various loads. When prices are high (Europe) a constant „loss“ of 10% matters.

kyriii ,
@kyriii@troet.cafe avatar

@TechConnectify European perspective: it can makes sense with renewables since they are cheap/available during limited time. You want to charge as much as possible when the sun is shining.

Der_Lichttechniker ,
@Der_Lichttechniker@chaos.social avatar

@TechConnectify funny awg10 :)
Did a conection with double 4x50/25 last night. That's about AWG0/ AwG3.
Both cabls parallel can carry about 170KW on a 230/400V 3phase connection :)

I prepared both cables but wired only one as the fonal distibiutinbox is not made jet.

TheTramp ,
@TheTramp@mastodon.uno avatar

@TechConnectify In italy we are limited to 16A, unless you ask for a non domestic supply or a wall box.
Home charging is limited to 10A, which is enough to charge while at home for the next day.
I charge once a week, but commute on an e-bike.

matt ,
@matt@bigchat.social avatar

@TechConnectify in my case, I have free electricity during 11am-2pm each day - but I’m only able to charge on weekends for free as I’m at work all week. So charging quickly lets me have $0 charging sessions. Otherwise it’s really not worth it. (AUS)

sun_addict ,
@sun_addict@mastodon.social avatar

@TechConnectify We both work at home and we were thinking of using a normal 15A outlet to charge our next car, who will hopefully be electric.

eliasrm ,
@eliasrm@mastodon.social avatar

@TechConnectify I never use my charger over 15A (3.6 kW), and that is only during the day, when I have excess solar power, night charges are always done at 6A (1.4kW). So I agree, there is no need for huge dedicated circuits.

jaytorres ,
@jaytorres@mastodon.social avatar

@TechConnectify I get by on this too. Just using our existing dryer outlet. Tesla Model 3.

jason ,
@jason@logoff.website avatar

@TechConnectify frankly I have never stopped using the 120V “travel charger” that I got with my Bolt in 2020

I live alone and it’s the only car and yet.

curiousbadger ,
@curiousbadger@mstdn.social avatar

@TechConnectify We have a lot of “Time of Use" tariffs in the UK specifically for EVs. This gives us a short window of a very low price (say 7.5p/kWh) with the rest of the day penalised (at 29p/kWh vs a normal 24p/kWh). When you have these faster charging at home becomes more important. On the flip side, I drive my Model Y so infrequently I barely need to charge, and so I have the luxury of gaming a tracker tarrif, where the price changes every half hour. 24h window announced the day before.

raymierussell ,
@raymierussell@mastodon.scot avatar

@TechConnectify
That kind of KW at 240V is fairly typical of domestic electrical shower units popular in the UK. Having said that those circuits only need to operate for the length of the shower as they are instant hot water (after about 30 secs).
Lots of older properties have retrofitted and it is not a particularly expensive addition even if you get a tradesperson in to do it.

monorailtimes ,
@monorailtimes@worldkey.io avatar

@TechConnectify I have two EVs and we get along just fine with 1 32A Grizzl-E

wordshaper ,
@wordshaper@weatherishappening.network avatar

@TechConnectify Absolutely. I went for a larger charger when I got it installed because i had the space on the panel and my supply and it's ridiculous overkill, especially because I need to charge at most once a week.

gudenau ,
@gudenau@fosstodon.org avatar

@TechConnectify I have a Chevy Bolt and I charge it twice a week, once on Wednesday and once on Sunday. I could probably get away with charging once a week but I want some emergency range available. When I only had L2
1 I'd plug it in for an additional night.

I think my L2 EVSE is setup for 40 which is excessive for me.

TechConnectify OP ,
@TechConnectify@mas.to avatar

There are a lot of factors to consider if you are able to install a charger circuit, but you can open up many headaches if you insist on running a 50 amp circuit. Especially if you've got limited electric service.

5kW chargers deliver roughly 15 miles of range per hour. So in an 8 hour overnight charge you can expect 100 miles easily.

My personal opinion is that unless you have an extreme commute or a big truck of an EV, 5kW is plenty, 7kW is luxurious, & anything above is probably not needed.

ironiridis ,
@ironiridis@mspsocial.net avatar

@TechConnectify Do we have a consensus yet on whether slower chargers are overall better for battery health?

TechConnectify OP ,
@TechConnectify@mas.to avatar

@ironiridis at level 2 speeds I doubt there's a difference. The battery pack is so big that even on an 11kW charger it's more of a trickle charge than a phone on a 5V 1A USB brick.

cm ,
@cm@chaos.social avatar

@TechConnectify @ironiridis some cars are scarily inefficient at lower charge power levels, see https://www.smart-emotion.de/article/14-efficiency-and-electricity-grid-feedback-of-the-smart-ed-and-smart-eq/ for some measurement data. Sadly, I don't think anyone publishes comparison data for this across car models...

chloeraccoon ,
@chloeraccoon@mastodonapp.uk avatar

@TechConnectify 50A? Ouch, my entire incoming supply is only fused at 80A

TechConnectify OP ,
@TechConnectify@mas.to avatar

@chloeraccoon 200A service is reasonably common in the US. At least for single family homes built in the last few decades.

Keep in mind though that's single phase, and technically it can only sustain 80% load. So in practice you end up with ~40kW

chloeraccoon ,
@chloeraccoon@mastodonapp.uk avatar

@TechConnectify I've never actually lived anywhere here in the UK with a feed over 100A. I have seen a 200A feed.. but as it was an 8 bedroom/6 car garage house, I think we can class it as "not tipical"

wolf480pl ,
@wolf480pl@mstdn.io avatar

@TechConnectify @chloeraccoon what do people need 40kW for?

Here in Poland, my parents' average-sized house only has a ~17kW service (3-phase 230V fused for 25A per phase)

TechConnectify OP ,
@TechConnectify@mas.to avatar

@wolf480pl @chloeraccoon Need is a funny word.

Our electric code is designed to make tripping the main breaker almost an impossibility. So when load calculations are done, they are assuming someone will be cooking a meal, using the dryer, running hot water, and blasting the heat all at the same time.

This rarely ever happens, but the code presumes people aren't smart enough to manage their power draw. Unfortunately I think that's correct.

wolf480pl ,
@wolf480pl@mstdn.io avatar

@TechConnectify @chloeraccoon what's a dryer? /hj

stevewfolds ,
@stevewfolds@mastodon.world avatar

@TechConnectify @chloeraccoon
Brought 1962 house up to code & adding a line from new meter/breaker panel to parking area was easy to add.

envy ,
@envy@noot.noot.cloud avatar

@TechConnectify Meanwhile in Germany 11kW is common because it's just three-phase 16A at 230V and you can get that over 2,5mm² wire (which apparently is AWG 13 or 14). Of course the car needs to be able to charge from three-phase but I think this is the case for most cars.

jdiller ,
@jdiller@hachyderm.io avatar

@TechConnectify I went 50A more for future-proofing than for current needs. We don't really know what EV's will need in 10-15 years and I didn't want to have to redo it if I switch cars later.

TechConnectify OP ,
@TechConnectify@mas.to avatar

@jdiller I mean, energy is energy. The only reason an EV is going to need more energy is if it's larger.

jdiller ,
@jdiller@hachyderm.io avatar

@TechConnectify fair.

A more likely concern is that I end up with two of them.

In any case it turned into a whole panel replacement job (thank you, Stab-lok) so it was already a big headache.

teotwaki ,
@teotwaki@mastodon.online avatar

@TechConnectify I fully agree. I really believe many EVs have massively over-capacity batteries.

My PHEV maxes out at 3.7kW (AC only charger) and goes from zero to full in 4 hours. I can easily do 50km on that, 70km if I focus very hard.

Using the “regular house plug” adapter it takes about 10h, so I’m guessing that caps out around ~1200W.

Obviously my 100HP electric engine won’t win any speed awards, but it’s perfect for city commutes around Copenhagen.

DismalManorGang ,
@DismalManorGang@mastodon.online avatar

@TechConnectify
There’s no point to sizing the circuit larger than 1.25 (1.0/0.8) times car charging current. For my Model Y, it will draw up to 32 amps. So a 40 amp circuit is sufficient. Anything larger is added cost to no purpose. Almost always, the battery charger is in the device, in this case your EV.

bedast ,
@bedast@squirrelmob.com avatar

@TechConnectify I’ll second this. I have a 30A circuit, running 24A charging (80% circuit limit) which is 5.6kW. With my driving habits, I could charge maybe twice a month if I push things. I only charge more frequently than I really need to because I occasionally take weekend trips over 100 miles.

And this is way cheaper than most public charging. Especially DCFC.

Pretty sure my $600 EVSE has paid for itself at this point.

_yossi_ ,

@TechConnectify I love the ability to spontaneously go on a trip. Last week I got off work, noted that sunset isn't for a long while and drove 100 miles to a national park on a whim.

Having to add a charging stop, while not a deal breaker at all, is less fun than just going.

Maybe I'm just a weirdo. Or maybe California just has too many attractions of this type.

scott ,
@scott@typetura.social avatar

@TechConnectify 50 amp is the entire panel rating for apartments in my building. Electrifying all the things is proving to be difficult and expensive.

Bryan ,
@Bryan@macaw.social avatar

@TechConnectify
Just something to consider: some USA households are 3-4 vehicles and the first EV has shown a massive savings on fuel.

As the ICE cars need replacing they will be replaced with EV. A bigger charging circuit is definitely going to make this easier.

The incremental cost of having a 50 or 60 amp circuit is not that bad over installing a 30amp circuit.

https://transportgeography.org/contents/chapter8/urban-transport-challenges/household-vehicles-united-states/

durin42 ,
@durin42@mastodon.social avatar

@TechConnectify assuming the "3 miles per hour on a 15 amp 120v" figure holds, my old commute when I went to an office would be entirely served just off a boring outlet. Not even 240v.

But as someone that occasionally wants to weld things: yes, please weirdos, don't do math and install huge welder-friendly outlets in all the garages!

manicdee ,
@manicdee@mastodon.social avatar

@TechConnectify 100%

Over 3 years 8MWh delivered to my Model 3 through a 240V 10A GPO (ubiquitous Australian residential single phase) and Tesla UMC.

cypou ,
@cypou@mastodon.xyz avatar

@TechConnectify Agreed, but for a 2 EVs household? 7kW might be the new plenty. And 11kW the new luxurious 😀

onestar ,
@onestar@mastodon.social avatar

@TechConnectify I absolutely appreciate all your videos on the topic. They have educated me a ton on how this all works. Besides the need for power/storage infastructure, education on EVs is paramount. It's gonna take decades to break old conceptions on how we "fill up" our cars. No one cares about fast charging their smartphone while they sleep for 8 hours at night.

hamakei ,
@hamakei@mas.to avatar

@TechConnectify We have a variable tariff where the cost per kW changes every 30 minutes based on wholesale price. So a 7kW charger might make more sense for us as it would allow us to pull as much charge as possible during the low periods.

genecowan ,
@genecowan@mastodon.social avatar

@TechConnectify Seriously. Even if I manage to run the battery all the way down, simply plugging in to the 30A charger overnight does the trick and I get a full tank while I sleep.

anthropy ,

@TechConnectify not to mention how much more strain it puts on the grid if everyone wants these fast chargers and then only uses them for short unsustainable peaks rather than a marginally slower charge that allows for literally 10x the people to charge at the same time without issues

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